Tagalog is a derivative of the Malay languages as Bahasa Indonesia and Bahasia Malaysia are. They are languages of experiences and emotions. They are NOT languages of the MIND as English, Spanish, German, French, etc, which are derivatives of Latin, are. Latin, in turn, derives its concept from Ancient Greek, which of course found its development through philosophy. Here, one can already see why Tagalog can’t be used efficiently to develop concepts and ideas. It falters miserably the moment it tries; the reason why Teddy Locsin says Tagalog is circular.
Just listen to Chiz Escudero, who uses a lot of Tagalog words. He appears to say many things, but in the end really says nothing. See, we don’t even have words for idea and concept. We translate them as “idea” (which we pronounce as ee-de-ya, just to make it sound Tagalog) and “konsepto”.
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When the “nationalists”, the stupid kind, started pushing Tagalog in the academe, and we gave in, we started the mass bobo-zation of Filipinos. Not only have we cut out the students from the body of knowledge which we used to enjoy access to via Spanish and English, we removed from them a subconscious that is philosophical. Thus, emotion took precedence over intellect and thinking.
We see in current President Benigno Simeon Aquino one who exemplifies this bobo-zation. As Sen Osmeña says, he is so hard-headed. People who closely work with him say he can’t understand things unless it is put to him in graphics. It is the experience and emotion that counts with him, not the hard work that is needed when one needs to think. He is comfortable with Tagalog in his speeches because it is the experience he needs, not the mind. And in an environment that is inside a bubble such as that experienced while living in a Palace, of course, that experience is detached from reality. Naturally, the president becomes delusional. He made this worse by exclusively using a speechwriter who was just a fresh graduate in 2010. He can’t use older speechwriters with depth and sense of history because that won’t be him; he is a fifty-year-old man with a brain of a teen-ager.
English foundationally depends on the verb “is”, which is the expression of “to be”. That comes from the Latin, ens and esse. “To be”, or the act of being, is the center of reality of Greek philosophy. “To exist”, one has “to be” first; that is the reality. The impact of recognizing “to be” on the subconscious assures one is operating profoundly in a reality that is real.
Something was lost in the translation from Greek to “esse”, and somewhat further lost when translated to “to be”. The confusion today is that there is no consensus on the certainty of reality. Some say reality depends on one what one thinks (Individualism); a product of Cartesian’s: Cogito, Ergo Sum (I think, therefore I am). Some say reality is what I will (Islam). Some say reality is what I feel (Aldub Nation). Some say reality is what I can use (Utilitarianism). Some say reality is where the money is (Materialism). Yet, deep inside us, we know we possess truth when we conform our mind to what is real, which is normally outside of us individually.
Yet, somewhere, English has not totally lost that reality based on the “act of being”. When we use English, “to be” remains embedded in the subconscious. Nothing like that can be said about Tagalog. How do we even translate: “to be or not to be, that is the question?” Ang pagiging o hindi pagiging, yan ang tanong? Hahaha. Even consider our word “ay”. Is it the best translation of “is”? But we also use “ay” in say, “ay naku”. So, are we embedding some reality in our mind when we use “ay”, or are we just confirming we are simply emotional creatures, and not intellectual? So, how can we even know our identity, if our “ay” has a hazy proposition with regards to reality?
We have to decide whether we want to continue thinking with our emotions, or not. Singapore had long ago decided. They had Malay, but they chose English because Malay is inefficient with its long, repetitive words. As Locsin rightly observes, it is circular. They even could have opted for Chinese, but chose English. They would have been okay with Chinese, as Chinese, even if it is just a sound-based language, is a very intellectual language in written form; the reason why Koreans and Japanese had to find a way to simplify the Chinese characters.
But, of course, we will never decide, because the oligarchs want a populace that is bobo-cized. See, they even use Kris Aquino to popularize Taglish, which is really gay talk. No wonder, the Philippines is all chuvaness: Filipinos that are all charot, and no balls. They eat like pigs because somehow they think they are just brutes with emotions; they live to eat, not eat to live. There was a time when Filipinos still spoke Spanish and English, that table manners and etiquette were quite important for them. Now, that too is gone. It is the most savage thing these ultra-nationalists inflicted on the country. In their paranoia and rush for uniqueness in the world, a search for self identity and dignity, they, in the end, attacked savagely the very identity and dignity they wanted to elevate. Why? Because Tagalog cannot be a national language. It is inherently a dialect of emotion, and that is all it is, and remains as such. Proud to be Filipino?????
GRP Featured Comment hall-of-famer. Former executive of the Far East Regional Office of a US-based multinational company living out of a suitcase covering the market from Tokyo to Mumbai to Melbourne, and all the countries within that triangle. Got tired after logging 300k air miles per year. Now, I just have a little trading biz on specialty chemicals.
I am confused when you talk and speak about reality, especially this part:
“Yet, deep inside us, we know we possess truth when we conform our mind to what is real, which is normally outside of us individually.”
So if/when each individual sees the reality outside him-/herself, then … who/what is reality?
For all I know, reality is what I see and how I can change/alter that reality.
Robert Haighton,
Here’s an example of reality for you that no one will dare challenge:
You’re born, live for a little while, and die.
Everything else we do in-between are just extras (dreams, goals, or delusions) to give our lives meaning.
Aeta
Aeta,
my life follows the same path: born, live for a little while, and die, with the exception that I am in full control of/over that little while that I live and when I will die. Nobody else will decide when and how I will die and how I will live my life.
Robert Haighton,
We all like to convince ourselves that we have full control of our lives. The reality is we don’t have control over our lives except will them in certain directions that we would like them to go and hope they stay on course.
What happens to our lives are out of our control—in much the same way you and I don’t decide how we live our lives (they’re all affected by various factors, internal and external); and how, where, and when we will die.
It’s only our attitude on how we deal with what happen to our lives that we can control.
Aeta
Aeta,
the only moment I dont have power over my own life is when I board a plane (MH17, MH370) or train but such incidents are rare. For the rest I have full control over my life. I know what will happen tomorrow (go to work, come back home, buy groceries, eat my dinner, work a little at home and go to bed). When off work, my days are also well planned.
Today I am married, tomorrow I am single again (divorce); today I live, tomorrow I am dead (euthanasia); today I am pregnant, tomorrow I am not (abortion). Today I am home, tomorrow I will be knocking on your door (because I decide to visit you).
Life is basically very simple and reasonably planned.
The same applies for being unemployed. So really, it baffles me why you dont know what ‘tomorrow’ will bring. Life is actually quite boring when so much is planned ahead of time.
What baffles me more is what Add’s statement about reality has to do with language. Maybe Add thinks that god decides about each individual’s life/live but that is sheer impossible bec we – the individual – plan everything. We go to work tomorrow and we will return back home at the end of the office day.
Dear Aeta,
I really dont know and dont understand why you are saying what you are saying. But if I had/have to live in accordance to ‘your’ rules/views then whats the point of living anyway?
I have to rely on myself and focus on my will to live. Concentrate on others in traffic (so that I dont get surprised and maybe get killed or injured/wounded). As long as follow the traffic rules and pay attention to my fellow traffickers then I will live any other day.
Maybe your rules/views do apply for most of the Filipinos but not for me (without wanting to sound arrogant). That is why, I prefered Add would have written his famous line differently, namely like this:
” Yet, deep inside me, I know I possess truth when I conform my mind to what is real, which is normally outside of me individually.”
Then at least he was speaking on behalf of himself. And not as he did now on behalf of the global world wide population.
Robert Haighton,
Dude, you have a very unrealistic version of what control is:
“I know what will happen tomorrow (go to work, come back home, buy groceries, eat my dinner, work a little at home and go to bed). When off work, my days are also well planned.
“Today I am married, tomorrow I am single again (divorce); today I live, tomorrow I am dead (euthanasia); today I am pregnant, tomorrow I am not (abortion). Today I am home, tomorrow I will be knocking on your door (because I decide to visit you).”
I will agree with you on one thing, though: “life is simple”; but, you’ve just made it more complicated by trying to control it.
You go to work tomorrow because you’re expected to or you’ll lose your job. This means you’re way of life is controlled by a society that says you have to continue to be a productive cog in the wheel if you want to remain an acceptable part of it. That’s not full control of your life, buddy. It’s called responding, or reacting, to the demands of life.
Aeta
Aeta,
maybe you are right that I am responding slash reacting. But mind you, I could have stayed at home after graduation and decide to stay unemployed. I decided to make my talents work for me. Going to work is no sacrafice. I enjoy doing my job. In return it rewards me with a good salary and with that salary I can do a lot. ‘Arbeit macht frei’.
What is your problem, brother?
To control my life, gives me full power over my own life. Being unemployed gives me less power bec no salary. But my life will still be in my power. That are not complicated factors. They are so in-nate that it feels like a second skin.
Okay, I will give it to you bec something just hits me. I dont know when I need to go to the toilet to poo. Okay you win. Duh.
geez, you have no god?
Robert Haighton,
Dude, you have a very unrealistic version of what control is:
“I know what will happen tomorrow (go to work, come back home, buy groceries, eat my dinner, work a little at home and go to bed). When off work, my days are also well planned.
“Today I am married, tomorrow I am single again (divorce); today I live, tomorrow I am dead (euthanasia); today I am pregnant, tomorrow I am not (abortion). Today I am home, tomorrow I will be knocking on your door (because I decide to visit you).”
I will agree with you on one thing, though: “life is simple”; but, you’ve just made it more complicated by trying to control it.
You go to work tomorrow because you’re expected to or you’ll lose your job. This means your way of life is controlled by a society that says you have to continue to be a productive cog in the wheel if you want to remain an acceptable part of it. That’s not full control of your life, buddy. It’s called responding, or reacting, to the demands of life.
Aeta
Robert Haighton,
I have problems just like every Tom, Dick, Harry, and Jane of this world. Most of the problems I have had in the past is trying to control all facets of my life, which I know for one is unrealistic; second, it’s not possible.
I’m just trying to explain that little fact of life to you and get you to loosen up about this control thing. Whatever semblance of control you have over your life is just your ego convincing your mind that ‘I got this life thing licked.’ No one has anything licked; we’re just think we do.
Just live life, brother, and tell others to do the same. I hope everything comes out all right on your way to the shitter.
Aeta
Then stop trying and just say ‘bahala na’ with everything you do and everything you dont do.
Robert Haighton,
I have problems just like every Tom, Dick, Harry, and Jane of this world. Most of the problems I have had in the past is trying to control all facets of my life, which I know for one is unrealistic; second, it’s not possible.
I’m just trying to explain that little fact of life to you and get you to loosen up about this control thing. Whatever semblance of control you have over your life is just your ego convincing your mind that ‘I got this life thing licked.’ No one has anything licked; we just think we do.
Just live life, brother, and tell others to do the same. I hope everything comes out all right on your way to the shitter.
Aeta
Robert Haighton,
Still gotta eat, still gotta live. I’m just doing what I can to make it from moment to moment until I die. All I know is I’m just responding, or reacting, to what goes on in my life, but don’t try to control it.
Aeta
Aeta,
I am perfectly fine with how you sort out your life.
I just cant imagine that many surprises cross your path that may bring you OFF in such way that your life comes to a complete stand still (literally or not literally).
Robert Haighton,
I’ve been around long enough, and have done enough, that not too many things surprise me anymore. Let’s just say I’m winding down and trying to get the remainder of my life perspective in order. Whereas younger people still seek knowledge (fame and fortune), I only seek wisdom. You’ll undestand what I’m talking about when you get there.
Aeta
We/You/I are never too old to learn, to seek knowledge and to seek wisdom. But to start doing all that in the latter phase of my life is a bit not functional anymore. During my retirement I will focus myself completely on my hobbies, leisure, vacation, reading books and still absorp new things.
Seeking and finding wisdom (and knowledge) must be practical and functional.
I just think we agree to disagree on most issues here. I accept that.
Robert Haighton,
That knowledge you speak of is endless and you’ll never achieve it all in your lifetime, or have any use for all of them. The same goes with wealth or other material gain.
Wisdom, however, is something you should be familiar with in all stages of your life, even if you don’t start appreciating it until you’ve been around the block a few times.
Once you start feeling your age and everyone dying off around you, it’s the only companion you’ll have all the way to your last breath. So, start being more intimate with wisdom even if you think you’re not ready for it.
Aeta
Aeta,
Based on your words of wisdom, I take it that you are older (most likely much older) than I am. I still have about 35 years to go till I will be cremated (or so much sooner when hit by an incurable disease; although I rule out the latter). I intend to enjoy each day and live it. Gaining knowledge and wisdom each day is part of the journey till the end whether alone or surrounded by many.
Nothing to be confused about, Robert. If it is red, it is red. If I say it is green that I see, either I want to deceive myself or somebody, or I am color blind. But, that red will not turn to green just because I say it is green. That red, which is outside of me, will also tell me I am color blind, if I insist it is green. Witnessed by somebody, who might bring along other witnesses, to support his view that it is red, such witnesses will then confirm that indeed what is being viewed is red. They will be the one to tell me I am deceiving myself, or I am color blind.
Or, did I confuse you the more with this?
Add,
I couldn’t have said it better myself. Now I guess we’re both wondering if and when Robert Haighton will understand our explanation. I’m running out of ways to explain things to him that he’ll understand. And it’s getting late.
Aeta
Robert Haighton,
May the forces of Knowledge be with you forever. Goodnight.
Aeta
Thanks, Aeta
What you just said is very clear and not at all confusing. Ergo: I totally agree with you.
Maybe just maybe somebody painted it red.
Hahaha
I will not interfere with the nice conversation that you, Robert and Aeta, are having. You two are just proving what GRP has been saying. You could only carry such intellectual exercises with English, Dutch, French, etc., and not in Tagalog (i.e., assuming Robert can speak in Tagalog)
But, I will comment on this:
I know, Robert, you may not appreciate the inadequacy of certain languages because you are a European, but Tagalog is one of those languages with such deficiencies. Of course, the basic object of language and communication is reality.
Let us not go into God discussion, because that is not part of above article. (I think you are getting defensive with me, zaxx, and Grimwald because we sometimes take up this matter. Relax, man, not this time. Hahaha)
Add,
my pinay GF (now ex) and I sat down a few times to teach me some Cebuano words (funny circumstance: she is a teacher). But not the structure, syntaxis of how a Cebuano sentence is build (no criticism). In short, my knowledge of the Cebuano language is basically zero. I have been looking for some Spanish influence by “spying” on her written posts on FB to her pinay friends. But I didnt spot one ‘manana’. To actually hear English words in a overwhelming Cebuano sentence, was funny (not insulted meant) for me.
I think it was Benign0 (If I am not mistaken) who said once that the Filipino language doenst have a word for ‘efficient’. That was a bit shocking but not something to start a war over.
I am not here to disagree with you regarding the point of your article but I humbly think that the national language (with all its seperate/distinctive dialects) is in part the identity of a population (or at least the identity of Cebuanos).
Although probably the Australian Aboriginals also spoke/speak a different language than the English most Aussies speak today.
Robert,
I can never advocate the removal of the dialects. As you correctly say, they are, and will always be, part of the national identity.
But, we were just doing fine with English as the medium of instructions in schools, as well as the official language in documents of government and business until some crazy group started lobbying for Tagalog in lieu of English. Their lobby was successful, and that is when education went to hell in a hand basket. Then, they started calling Central Bank as Bangko Sentral, etc, if you know what I mean. Right there is the inadequacy of the language. And yet they persist, without doing anything about it.
I must say that is also when the exodus of teachers started. Imagine teachers applying for jobs as domestic helpers in Hong Kong. I don’t know, but they could not retain the dignity that teachers should have in themselves. It is used to be that teachers had the highest dignity in a community. I know because two of my aunts were teachers.
Yes, I am/was aware that Filipino teachers had the highest dignity in a community. And I also think that I understand how that came about. Teachers also being the ‘mothers’ of the pupils.
In my country we have a different view about teachers. Its a very volatile/fragile industry because households nowadays having less kids than ever before (in my country).
I want to be clear: I don’t care which national language we have as long as we have a practical, working language. Every language in the world is capable of being a tool for intellectual purposes, it just so happen Tagalog literature has a shortage of it, hence I use English.
Tagalog borrowing words
* Every language does it, heck even English does it. So once Tagalog imports English words, does it make Tagalog intellectual :-)? As long as the speakers of Tagalog in general demand better literature beyond silly jokes and tiresome romance stories, I’ll stick with English.
Tagalog and verb “be”
* Tagalog doesn’t have an equivalent word for “be” because it’s implied.
* The word “ay” isn’t English “be”, it’s just a marker to switch the “focus” of the sentence, marked with ang/si, in front.
Naglalakad si Juan -> Si Juan ay naglalakad (Juan is walking)
* The word “be” is the most overloaded word in English. there are some who advocated against using “be” due to its ambiguity and excessive use. (Personally, I take it as a nice guideline, not a hard rule to follow, but such limitation imposed does wonders).
In short, English–in spite of all its complex rules–is a very rich language to learn and has worldwide applications. Tagalog on the other hand, and other Failipino dialects, has poorly-defined rules and not applicable to everyone. And when the rules of a language are not clear, consistently enforced, or contributes to the progress of an entire nation, then it should be taken out of the mainstream vernacular.
Ginoong Add, maaari mo po bang maisalin ang mga pangungusap na nasa ilalim sa wikang Ingles:
“Pang-ilan lathala na ba kahalintulad nito ang naisulat at natalakay dito?”
“Hindi nangunguhulugang hindi patimbulog ang lihit ng bolitas sa pangkalahatang antas
dahil lang nagdudulot ang tiwaling pagkakamulatil sa pagbabago nito sa nanometro.” (written at 22 words, try to translate the same in english!)
Does size really matter?
Hahaha. That surely is less than 22 words.
I wouldn’t even try to translate the quote because it has no global relevance.
This comment does not translate to anything but in your own oft-repeated words just definitely “aristocratic (hambog) and self-serving (kanya-kanya, but in this case, para sa sarili mo lang!)”.
ETAT,
My “Oft-repeated words” (I have to drill my message in through our thick-headed people’s all the time to remind them of who they are because they’re so forgetful) of ‘aristocratic (hambog) and self-serving (kanya-kanya) applies to me, you, and everyone who calls themselves a Failipino.
Remember, we all came from the same lot. Therefore, my shit smells just as bad as yours, and we all wallow in them each and every moment till we’re blue in the face.
Aeta
After drawing flak, Teddy Locsin Jr. defends ‘Tagalog’ comment
Here, Mr. Teddy Locsin also communicates with the masses in Tagalog (or Taglish) but bungles!
>> When the “nationalists”, the stupid kind, started pushing Tagalog in the academe, and we gave in, we started the mass bobo-zation of Filipinos. Not only have we cut out the students from the body of knowledge which we used to enjoy access to via Spanish and English, we removed from them a subconscious that is philosophical. Thus, emotion took precedence over intellect and thinking.
Nice exposition Add! This supports my theory that Tagalog is a language suited for singing and poetry (emotions), not intellectual / technical discussions.
How I wish we had a time machine and go back to reverse what has been done to this country. They phased out English for a weakling.
It’s so obvious guys – why can’t you see it? Filipinos should choose between which of the two equations they want to apply to their lives:
(1) English = Knowledge + Wealth
(2) Tagalog = Incompetence + Poverty
Of course, Pinoys will choose (2) right? because Pinoy pride is heaven on earth and all that ever matters in life!
Tagalog is the lazy man’s language. If one is too lazy to learn English, then he gets the poverty he deserves.
If Filipinos only really loved their country, they would adopt English in classrooms, formal gatherings, speeches and debates. Then the national psyche will ascend – the lower class will rise to become middle class, and middle class to upper middle. Then we will become a Singapore.
PNoy at Kris – mga pasimuno ng pag-Tatagalog. Miski si Erap nga nag-tTH mag-Ingles e. Si Cory at mga anak niya ang nag-pabagsak ng taong bayan tungo sa landas ng kaboboan.
Since FM was a top-class English speaker, the Yellow camp has rejected everything he stood for (throwing the baby with the bathwater): nuclear energy, English excellence, executive decision-making/planning, etc.
It’s time we bring back model English speakers – it’s time we bring in the intellectuals of the IRON Camp (MDS + DU30 + BBM + APC) – any pair will do.
The end of Pinoy zombification is in the offing.
Nice add-on to the article. Appreciate it, man.
That’s why it’s a good read when it’s a Zaxx-Add Combo Article. Keep it going!
an intelligent post.. but seriously will never translate to whatever its worth.. human kind as of the moment is already bombarded with politically correct terms and double speak that our forefathers willingly accepted believing they transcended into intellectuals filled with ideologies but really turned them and the next generation into sheep.. so this shaming of the tagalog, as alarming as you might want to sound, is just read worthy, nothing more.
I have to agree on some level. In addition to English I learned to speak Spanish and French. Whenever I converse in Bisaya or Tagalog I feel like I’m going backward towards primitive expression. I guess you don’t realize this about your mother tongues until you learn other languages, particular Western ones.
When you use: “salam puwit”, instead of : “silya”, to name a: “chair”. The Tagalog Purists have dumbed this country, already.
My first language is English…I speak and write also several foreign languages. I use also Tagalog.
Multilingualism helped me, understand better the world and people.
Yeah, it wouldn’t hurt to be multilingual :-). I know Tagalog and English. I have a passing knowledge of Spanish, a tiny bit of German. In the near future, I plan to study Cebuano and Hiligaynon.
main difference between Tagalog and English seems to be that the former is mainly an oral language, and the latter mainly written.
but is there a true and valid translation of Chaucer or Shakespeare or John Donne or Milton or Charles Dickens into Tagalog, or is there something inevitably lost in the translation?
It for me demonstrates that language is a reflection of the advancement or backwardness of its society. For example, Tagalogs or other people in the Philippines, usually have no modern sciece, technology or understanding of philosophy unless it is brought in by foreigners. Without that foreign introduction of stuff, Filipinos effectively remain in the stone age. My history teacher in Ateneo (yes, that vaunted institution, but I believe this one is a credible quote) told me that there is no modern Filipino culture. All indigenous Filipino stuff is quite primitive, and anything modern or up-to-date really comes from foreign cultures. It’s quite a ways before our own local culture really modernizes, because even Filipino mindsets are stone age. Take note of Kate Natividad’s article about “intellectuals” dumbing down in the Money Talks section.
Also, I’m reminded of this article again by Nick Joaquin written in 1965. Note that he already called the Philippines a failed society, because he noticed “bobo-ization” during this time. Yes, that long ago.
Language and culture are two sides of a coin.
`Yung mga bansang Japan, South Korea at Taiwan kung ikukumpara satin mas mahina sila sa wikang Englis. Pero naging maunlad ang mga bansang yun sa kabila ng kahinaan sa Englis.
Matagal na hong ipinipilit ang wikang Englis para kuno e paunlarin ang bansang Pilipinas. Mga ilang dekada na rin (oo, huwag kang magugulat). Naalala mo nung panahon ng Martial Law kapag nagbibigay ng pahayag ang mga poilitko, palagaing sa wikang Englis? Sa kabila noon, ano ba ang kinahinatnan ng bansa natin? Wala rin di ba?
Kung talagang ikinasusuka niyo ang wikang Filipino, malaya naman ho kayong manirahan sa ibang bansa na gumagamit ng wikang Englis. Bukas ho ang pinto, puwede kayong lumabas kahit anong oras.
Human Observer,
You are pretty narrow-minded and a good example of a typical Failipino, who is unwilling to change for the good of the country, because he or she is very adamant of holding on to a useless “Pinoy Pride,” impractical cultural values and traditions, and a regional dialect that has been unceremoniously imposed by the aristocratic founders of the Republic.
The Japanese, Koreans, and Taiwanese respectively spoke the same language and understood each other well. This is the reason why these countries are more successful than the Failippines, and there is no need to adopt English as their national language; their people are doing just fine of communicating effectively with one another using their own language.
Unfortunately, we cannot say the same for more than 175 dialects (including Tagalog) spoken in the Failippines, where people from various regions and different dialects are always in rampart competition with each other for elitism and national language, respectively, to represent the entire Failippine archipelago.
Our people’s unwillingness to adopt one language (other than regional dialects that included Tagalog) is the primary reason why Failipinos have so much disparity among themselves.
You claim that during Martial Law the government tried to impose English as the primary language for the nation and it did not work. Now I know why. It is because of Failipinos like you, who are afraid to change their aristocratic and selfish ways, for fear of losing their cultural identity that was rooted from a long history of oppression and brainwashing delusions.
It is also kind of late for you to ask pro-English language Failipinos to leave your country that no longer belongs to you and your people, because it has been sold out to other countries and special interest groups. So whatever it is you are trying to hold on to that you still cherish as being traditionally Failipino, has lost its meaning–if there ever was one–a long time ago, since the people are not willing to live like one people and one nation.
Aeta
Ya, I am a balikbayan from the States, and can always go back for I still have a house there, which I am renting out. But, that is none of business, boy.
Correction….. should read: none of your business
You don’t do justice t the Malays and Indonesians. Bahasa actually descended from Filipino as our Austronesian forebears moved down from Taiwan down through the Philippines and through the Indonesian Archipelago.
Malay is actually grammatically and phonetically very simple. It lent itself well to becoming a trade language all around Malaysia and Indonesia. Because of the diverse cultures of it’s speakers, Malay actually became quite a versatile language–it is intellectual and multi-cultural.
In the case of Indonesia, Malay is not even a major language there nor is it spoken by an influential ethnic group. The major cultures there are the Javanese, Balinese, Madurese and others. The Timorese probably had more native speakers than Malay. But by legislative fiat, Malay was chosen as the official language of Indonesia. One of the considerations for this is that the government did not want to antagonize the ethnic groups living there. Malay was easy enough to learn and allowed them to have meaningful relations with Malaysia (and now Brunei and Singapore), you can forget about konfrontasi though haha.
Indonesia made the correct decision. Had the Philippines achieved independence after Indonesia, I have no doubt that Malay would have been a strong contender for Official Language in the Philipones.
Also, just to add, the word “ay” does not exactly function as a copula in Filipino. It is a marker of sentence inversion. To illustrate, the correct word order of a Filipino sentence would go “maitim ang pusa” an inverted sentence would use the marker “ay” as in, “Ang pusa ay maitin“.
The equivalent of the verb “to be” in Filipino would be “maging“.
I get all that, Dick. But, how intellectual is the Malay languages? It seems not inviting for abstract thinking. Chinese had Confucius, Taoism, etc. Arabs had Averroes, Avicenna, etc. Indians modified Zoroastrianism. Well, I don’t need to mention the Western philosophies, but I think you get what I am saying.
You’re right. It probably isn’t meant for philosophy and science but then again, it’s probably better than Filipino.
Add, the real question here is how intellectual the literature of the Malay languages is, not the languages themselves, don’t you think?
You have a point there, Onesimus. And, that is my problem; I am not aware of any Bahasa literature that is world renowned in some way. And yet, if they have to pass on something to the next generation, or have to cultivate a culture, literature has to be foundational.
Character is like a tree and reputation its shadow. The shadow is what we think it is and the tree is the real thing.
I totally agree with the all questions you raised. I was searching for the same form some time ago
and
found a great service with a huge forms library. BTW, if anyone needs to fill out a SC DoR SC1120, I found a blank fillable form here
http://goo.gl/RMeS5nStupid is as stupid does….If you share this you are as stupid as the getrealphilippines blogger. The article has no author. No responsibility of ownership. Coward he will write a derogatory statement about the Filipino language and will not commit ownership. Blaming also the educated for intending to dumb down the Filipinos. Reason the Filipinos dumbed down because of the low budget intended for Education.. Reason the anti-intellectuals keep on pushing for non-intellect as intellect. Reason slang nonsense is rampant because of mass media. The masses find it entertaining that is why this language becomes steet popular language. The filipino language has substance, The vocabulary has become archaic and less functional due to the fact that the brain of the populace has shrunk to gay speak. Because of mind limitations and for no other. Philosophy reason literature spoken in Filipino has been relegated by the masses, as they prefer Vice ganda, eat bulaga, Kris A., telenovela and TV as source for their lingua franca
As the husband of a Filipino woman and a student of Tagalog I can fully attest to the truthfulness of your statements. In addition to what you said I find Tagalog to be a rather incomplete language. How do you for example tell the difference between “faithfulness” and “loyalty”? “Tapat” is the only word that comes to my mind but while a dog can only be faithful a human being can be both faithful and loyal….when it comes to expressing nuances Tagalog seems to me as a rather di-kumpletong wika
Ciao, Eduardo!
As a Foreigner/student of Tagalog, and hopefully, an open-minded, I invite you to read the articles below and then tell us about your afterthoughts:
“Tagalog vs English? Take the 30-word challenge!”
https://www.getrealphilippines.com/2011/04/tagalog-vs-english-take-the-30-word-challenge/
A certain commenter did it with 22 words! Can something equivalent or similar be done with an Italian translation?
Marvin Kaiser says:
“Dear blogger, here is my translation based on the 32-word translation. ? I collapsed it into 25 words by using the “karaniwang ayos ng Tagalog”, because all of you guys used the “di-karaniwang ayos” which would obviously yield a higher word count. And I changed some words too. Here are my translations of 25, 23, and 22 words each. Just see the differences.
“Hindi nangunguhulugang walang kinalaman ang lihit ng bolitas sa anyong pantimbulog sa pangkalahatang antas
dahil lang nagdudulot ang tiwaling pagkakamulatil sa pagbabago nito sa nanometro. 25
“Hindi nangunguhulugang walang anyong patimbulog ang lihit ng bolitas sa pangkalahatang antas
dahil lang nagdudulot ang tiwaling pagkakamulatil sa pagbabago nito sa nanometro. 23
“Hindi nangunguhulugang hindi patimbulog ang lihit ng bolitas sa pangkalahatang antas
dahil lang nagdudulot ang tiwaling pagkakamulatil sa pagbabago nito sa nanometro. 22”
(Well, benign0 says it’s “Brilliant! Well done!” ?)
GRP is just an opinion blog with its own points of view, but, so are some people from the academe, like La Salle Professor, Dr. Antonio Cotreras:
(Quite frankly, GRP, inadvertently, may have influenced some of its readers (though not entirely of their own wrong-doing, but, in taking them not as intended) along the path of alienating themselves from who they really are in their confused effort of becoming world citizens first instead of being as Filipinos. Colonial Mentality, as a virtue, among confused Filipinos is still quite strong and very much around!)
“The shaming of the national language”
https://www.manilatimes.net/the-shaming-of-the-national-language/468961/
Arrivederci, Baby!
“Filipino Lesson 201: A Brief History of the Tagalog and Filipino Language”
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKxwFhhmH2A&w=560&h=315%5D
Wow! Even benign0 fails in his attempt with his own challenge!
Thanks for your reply. I’ll check it out after work, few hours from now and I’ll give you feedback ASAP. Thank you
Just because molecular irregularities cause a ballbearing’s radius to vary by nanometers along its surface does not stop us from attributing a spherical quality to it at a macro level.
In Italian that could be expressed as: “il fatto che delle irregolarità molecolari creino delle variazioni nanometriche lungo la superficie del raggio di un cuscinetto non impedisce di attribuirgli caratteristiche sferiche a livello macroscopico”=27
I try it in Tagalog: “bagaman ang pagiging di-regular ng mga molekula ng isang ballbearing ay nagiging sanhi ng nanometrical na pagbabago ng radius sa surface nito hindi ito humahadlang na ituring nating ito ang isang spera sa macro level” …..or something like that
Estudiante (blues) pa lang ako
Not bad! 🙂
….or maybe: “bagaman ang pagiging di-regular ng mga molekula ng isang bolitas ay nagiging sanhi ng napakaliit na pagbabago ng radius sa ibabaw nito hindi itong humahadlang na ituring ito ang isang bilog sa kabuaan”
….my Filipino wife who has a college degree has no clue so I have had to figure it out myself
Shorter version=”Kahit ang kawalang-regularidad ng mga molekula ng isang bolitas ay sanhi na may napakaliit na pagbabago ng radius sa ibabaw nito bilog pa rin siya sa kabuuan”
@Eduardo
“As the husband of a Filipino woman and a student of Tagalog I can fully attest to the truthfulness of your statements.”
Pardon me, but, would you allow yourself to be in agreement with someone, who obviously doesn’t have the proper academic background nor training, in offering you just his own opinionated and literal translation with no coherent real sense or meaning?
To wit:
“How do we even translate: “to be or not to be, that is the question?” Ang pagiging o hindi pagiging, yan ang tanong? Hahaha.”
(With the manner it was amateurishly translated by a poseur, the laugh is on him because it just sounds ridiculously funny, right?!)
Well, suit yourself but I would rather not!
Simply because to come up with a conclusion will not cut it when a position being asserted lacks the credibility or is not armed with the genuine academic expertise of the learned and that which may be deemed as not particularly apt, for an opinion blog as a source, to pass judgement on something beyond their stronger point.
I’m not a linguist myself, though, by applying a bit of intelligence and common sense, anyone can come up with something better, in its proper context, like this one below:
“Upang maging marapat ba o hindi, iyan ang katanungan?”
With that aside, the word ‘tapat’ is not the only one you can make use of for ‘loyal’ and ‘faithful’. While its usage can apply to both words, you can try:
taimtim (for prayer); wagas (for love); dalisay (for hangad or intention); bilib (for a reason); panalig/salig (for the rule of law); sampalataya (for the Divine); tiwala (for a decision or a cause).
Btw, the writer is either lying or clueless when he claims that there is no Filipino equivalent for words such as ‘idea’ and ‘concept’ (which are somewhat similar), so how about these:
kaisipan; ideya; konsepto; unawa; palagay; hagap/hinagap; kuro-kuro; haka/haka-haka; wari/wari-wari.
Colonial-mentality and mis-education among many Filipinos with their “sense of identity” discrepancies and “concept of nationhood” vagaries have rendered many of these words to become not as popular in colloquial/conversational practice but are very much alive in formal writing and speaking and literary use.
Good job on your translations! Exercises like these allows for cultural enrichment and scholarly development of the Filipino language… or any language for that matter.
Gina Lollobrigida (my tukayo or namesake) has a color photography book of the Philippines available in National bookstores here. Maybe one day you can try writing a book yourself in Filipino about your experiences here from an Italian perspective or something about to compliment that of your compatriot.
I tried to reply to your comment but I am not sure if I was able to load it so I try again: I know Filipino scholars who use napakalalim na Tagalog. For example I came across a Filipino scholar who explained the philosophy of Immanuel Kant in Tagalog. However, by and large, highly educated Filipinos can hardly communicate very profound mga konsepto without switching to English like my wife and my mother in law who used to teach in Bulacan but unless they speak English they just don’t have the ability to talk about science or any other malalim na paksa.
As for writing a book, yes, I might do that. For now I am just fooling around with my blog and I am also posting some videos on relationships in Tagalog (quite informal videos like: https://youtu.be/XTGc1LFfHmY or https://youtu.be/B92J5RW7I5Q)
I must definitely write an e-book
Have a nice day
Hi Eduardo, try to limit the hyperlinks on your comments to just one. The spam filter tends to pick up comments that include multiple hyperlinks. Thanks! ?
Ok. Maliwanag. Lilimitahan ko ang mga hyperlinks sa susunod.
Salamat
“However, by and large, highly educated Filipinos can hardly communicate very profound mga konsepto without switching to English like my wife and my mother in law who used to teach in Bulacan but unless they speak English they just don’t have the ability to talk about science or any other malalim na paksa.”
If you have the interest and time, you can check out Dr. Renato Constatino’s brilliant and thought-provoking essay, “THE MISEDUCATION OF THE FILIPINO” (originally written in 1959). It provides deep insights as to why we have this great divide re the National language issue.
Exceprt:
“The most vital problem that has plagued Philippine education has been the question of language. Today, experiments are still going on to find out whether it would be more effective to use the native language. This is indeed ridiculous since an individual can not be more at home in any other language than his own. In every sovereign country, the use of its own language in education is so natural no one thinks it could be otherwise.
“But here, so great has been our disorientation caused by our colonial education that the use of our own language is a controversial issue, with more Filipinos against than in favor! Again, as in the economic field Filipinos believe they can not survive without America, so in education we believe no education can be true education unless it is based on proficiency in English.”
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/7735/865e2ea8fd8d9662f3916ffe41cc14376706.pdf
Christian Bryan S. Bustamante,Ph.D. of San Beda in his writing of “Renato Constantino’s Discourses on Philippine Education as Post-Colonial: A Philosophical Reading” has this to say:
“Constantino noted the enrichment of Filipino national language is significant because it is the Filipinos’ cultural defense against the arrival of American hegemonic culture that is trying to establish a monoculture all over the world.”
“The English language did not only delay the development of the Filipino language as language of scholarly discourse and as medium of instruction. It did not only delay the enrichment of Filipino culture through scholarly activities, but it also caused separation between the Filipinos and their past. It separated the Filipinos to their past because it introduced them to a “strange, new world” as well as to a “new way of life, alien to their traditions and yet a caricature of their model.” They were disoriented consciously and unconsciously from their nationalist goals and no longer learn as Filipinos but as colonials. They studied harder to become ideal colonials, to become “carbon copy” of the Americans.
“It did not only create a divide between the present and past but also between the educated and the illiterate, between the
rich and the poor. The English language became the language and landmark of the elite, the well-placed and highly schooled. While the native language became the language of the masses and uneducated. Constantino observed: “English is used within family and the dialect is reserved for communication with the servants. How proudly the fond parents recount their children’s progress in English and how frightened they are of the growing popularity of Tagalog!”
http://scientia-sanbeda.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/vol_5.2_bustamante.pdf
Very interesting. Thank you
Have a nice day
“Pagiging” to me sounds more like “to become”. Maybe “umiral o hindi umiral. Ito ang isyu”….or “ito ang duda” or “ang alinlangan”
What about “katapatan” at “pagkamatapat” to describe faithfulness and loyalty?
Tagalog can be “malalim” enough to even talk about profound philosophical na mga konsepto such as, for example ang “Puna sa Dalisay na Pangangatwiran” ng pilosopo na Immanuel Kant. In Tagalog there are words like “epistemolohia” at “metapisika”.
It is just that the average Filipino highly educated hardly uses or even knows this kind of terminology in Tagalog
“Pagiging” (his/her/one’s becoming) from the root word “maging” (to be/ to become)
“umiral” (to exist in past-tense with prefix “um”) from the root word “iral” (to exist)
“duda” and/or “alinlangan” (means doubt)
“katapatan” at “pagkamatapat” are variants (with modifiers) from the root word “tapat” (which is “payak” or simple in form)
example: Eduardo’s wife is beautiful.
His wife is elegantly beautiful.
Immanuel Kant’s “Critique of Pure Reason” can be played up as “Masusing Pagsusuri sa Malinis at Walang Bahid na Kadahilanan” or “Suri sa Lantay na Rason” or simply “Puna sa Katuwiran”.
Tagalog or Filipino can be really be potentially deep but many western-worshiping Filipino minds would rather set their sights elsewhere; they’d rather act and pretend to be Americans with their English twang or with their British/Australian accents, as they find the local language “baduy” (out of trend or old-fashioned) or not totally hip nowadays.
It really puzzles the mind… if it does hurt being good at both?!
I have to add: the word “iral”, depending on context/usage, can also mean “prevalence”, “occurrence”, “predominance”, “effectiveness”.
Salamat sa clarification
The Italian Eduardo Maresca who has a high interest in the Philippine language and looking for something ‘malalim’, na tila ba humihiwa sa diwa at kamalayan, should find this original Filipino spoken word poetry, composed not by scholars but by ordinary young students, very interesting!
Papara ka ba?
https://www.facebook.com/OfficialFSW/videos/2167740500142036/
Salamat sa impormasyon. Susuriin ko iyan.
This is a crude way of explaining what I have been telling my husband about our filipino language. Our language is inefficient in terms of conveying a deeper sense of what is being said due to words repetitive use in different contexts. Now, our mother language is being watered down with non-sensical phrases use to convey emotion irrelevant to the words actual meaning. Like “yarn”, “churva”… etc. is a great example of the sad dumbmification or devolution of our society propagated by the oligarchs agenda to keep the masses in the dark.
In addition to my first comment. Our language has potential to be great and we should have (as a nation) have it ingrained in us because it is part of our identity. We should cultivate it further. However, we have watered it down with “taglish” and gay-lingo. It is a wonderful language turned rubbish through the years. Sad really as it is a gauge of where our nation’s education is really at.
Why?
The degradation of the Tagalog, as well as the English, language literacy in the Philippines started when the Yellow Party’s Socialist influence (hence the term “sosyal”) began defunding our educational system through government graft and corruption, and privatizing our public schools that used to follow strict Department of Education (DEPED) guidelines on how to educate our students.
This lack of resources and consistency on teaching the correct usage of Tagalog and English, correctly and independently of each other in the classroom, created huge learning gaps that resulted in young language learners (including educators) to fill in the void on how they communicate with others, through written and verbal forms, using both Tagalog and English (Tag-lish) languages, that eventually made their way into the vernacular of everyday communication in the country.
The bastardization of Tagalog and English into “Tag-lish,” and the lowering of the nation’s literacy through defunding and privatizing of the educational system, are some of the strategies the Yellow Party has been employing to dumb the population down, to make them easy subjects for media brainwashing, that has been going on for more than 3 decades.
Aeta
“Tagalog is a derivative of the Malay languages as Bahasa Indonesia and Bahasia Malaysia are.”
Man, just the first sentence and its already wrong.
Derivative? LOL. Tagalog and other languages of the Philippine subfamily of the Austronesian language family are OLDER than the Malayic subfamily. Our common seafaring Austronesian ancestors landed in the Philippines first from Taiwan BEFORE moving further southwest to Indonesia and Malaysia (as well as eastwards to Micronesia and Polynesia). It’s the reason why Tagalog and other Philippine languages have extremely complex grammar, with hundreds of affixes and combinations thereof, in comparion to Malay which barely has any.
Listen to how they sound. Philippine languages often have subtle nuances when it comes to how a verb is conjugated that’s almost completely absent in Malay. In fact, if translated literally, Malay would sound like Chinese in the way that their verbs are rarely affixed.
Contrast “Saya makan nasi” (literally “I eat rice”) in Malay with “Kumakain ako ng kanin” (“Eating I of rice”). Malay is for the most part, an analytical language, like Chinese. The meaning largely depends on the word order. We, on the other hand, retain what’s called the “Austonesian alignment”, a uniquely Austronesian way of communicating nuances that has already been lost in Malay. It also differs from the tenses in English, which is why 1:1 translations is difficult.
Austronesian alignment can identify the ACTOR and the RECEIVER of an action without rearranging the words like in English. Compare “Kumain ako ng isda” (I ate the fish) vs. “Kinain ako ng isda” (The fish ate me). And that’s just the simple part. It can impart numerous other differences purely by affixes, again without needing to change the word order. Including the location of an action, how often the action is, how true the action is, how long ago was the action done, and so on. Like “Nagpakain ako ng isda” (I am feeding the fish), “Pinakain ako ng isda” (The fish let me eat), “Kainan ako ng isda” (“I am the eating place of the fish”)., “Kinainan ako ng isda” (I was eaten from by the fish), “Ikinain ko ang isda” (“I used the fish to eat”), “Ikinain ako ng isda” (I was used to eat by the fish”), “Kinakain-kain ko ang isda” (“I ate the fish in small amounts/I pretended to eat the fish”), and so on.
Not to mention other unique aspects of our language like how we differentiate between the exclusive and the inclusive “we “. We can specify if we say “Kami” (“We, not including you”) vs. “Tayo”/”Kita” (“We, including you”). Or the plural “you” (“Ikaw” vs. “Kayo”). This is absent in English.
Why do we Filipinos keep thinking of ourselves as merely combinations of FOREIGNERS? We have our own culture, our own history. We are NOT Malays (though they’re our cousins, as fellow Austronesians). We are NOT Chinese. We are NOT Spanish. We are NOT Americans.
While I agree that English is a far better medium of instruction than Filipino (purely because Filipino lacks widely-accepted MODERN technical jargon), that doesn’t make Tagalog a “derivative.”
Also another thing I forgot to add. We can “verbify” anything. Unlike in English where verbs and nouns are always different things, to us, the difference is merely in how they are affixed. Thus we can turn nouns like “bahay” (house) into “binahayan” (lived in). Even loanwords can be used this way. Thus we can say “Nag-airplane” to say “Went by plane”, without needing an extra verb. The noun itself becomes the verb.
At least the author acknowledges the inadequacy of language in communication, since the rational mind can only process relative realities. There is probably an order to perception and expression of information that forms an internal and external reality. Somehow there has to be something that unites a set of information for it to have meaning or essence-or being. How else do you give life to an idea or concept without it
being or existing as energy? I’d like to say more, but words are just not enough.